"In Sweden, Norway, and the Netherlands, men actually work more than women, although the differences are small. In Belgium, Denmark, Finland, and the United Kingdom, women work slightly more, though less than 5 percent. Among rich countries, the largest differences emerge in Italy, where women work eight hours while men work only 6.5, and in France, where women work 7.2 hours and men 6.6."

Quoted from an article at Men and women's work Slate.

Then there's the housework, taking care of the family etc. I work only VERY part-time and my husband and I have no children, so I only have to pick up after him. But still, considering that houses here seem to be "spotlessly clean" here at any given time, seems as if those who do work full-time outside the home and also do everything at home, how does a woman here have any leisure/free time?
Ann
My Life in Italy

Well it's decided then... I'm staying and finding that Italian wife!!

Jeffo

Jeffo: "Well it's decided then... I'm staying and finding that Italian wife!!"

been there done that..wouldn't have missed it for anything..but...to rephrase the navy motto:
IT'S NOT A MARRIAGE..IT'S AN ADVENTURE!!!
oh...one other thing..if they're from pozzuoli, they NEVER die.they just thrive and take your money forever.ha (look at sophia for example..going strong and still bella,but poor old carlo ponti..gone and done with. ha)
anyway,Jeffo, that's a couple things to keep in mind.
my .02 lire

quote:

Originally posted by Judith in Umbria:
"in Italy, where women work eight hours while men work only 6.5"

I don't completely understand the figures... Does that mean that Italian men work a total of 6.5 hours in a day - homework + paid work? It doesn't sound enough to me. Maybe it's cutting out all the breaks, lunch etc.

The figures are combined out and home. Some do nothing, others do a lot.

My SIL works 6 hrs a day, and my daughter was working 9 hours a day with a half an hour lunch. Go Figure!!!! That's not fair!!!

The figures are combined housework and out of housework including weekends. So, for example, I work 40 hours a week in an office plus about 15 hours a week of housework, cooking etc. That's 55 hours a week of work divided by 7 (7 days in a week) which equals 7.85 hours of work per day on average.

Right. I need to do the maths. Not just now though, I'm too tired after working all those hours!

Unfortunately, in our household I work about 7.85 hours a day and my boyfriend works about 18 hours a day or something. Maybe we are skewing the statistics!

When i went to the questura a few months ago for an appointment, there were 6 people 'working' the same large office. I had my interview with the only woman in the room. ALL the men were doing one of the following things - playing computer games, smoking, drinking coffee, chatting on their mobile phones. When i left 45 mins later the status quo had not changed.

Wonder if/how they factor things like that into their calculations....

If you are working as much outside the home as your husbands, then get a maid if you don't like doing the extra things at home....if no maid, then your husband should share the house work as well if you are both working equally outside the house, and if he doesn't feel he should then you married the wrong guy.

They undoubtedly work harder but are partly to blame for excessively pampering their sons and starting the cycle all over again.

This reminds me of one of the amazing conversations I had with my husband, then boyfriend about men's and women's work.

I asked him what he meant by that one day. And back then I didn't have a lot of italian, so I was usually taking notes when we would converse. So I did this time too.

we had two columns, men's work and women's work.

He started out saying that both were supposed to make a lot of love together. So that was number one.

But the rest demonstrated a real inequality in the number of hours each would dedicate to the "family"

After we discussed that each person has 24 hours in a day, well the list did the rest.

I agree that the "I'll do it for you even if it means I have to take time from my health and peace of mind-- and beauty sleep(gotta keep up with priority number 1!) " really causes lots of problems. AS long as women continue to show that they don't need anything, well, we don't get anything. As long as we say "don't worry about me" well, no one does.

If Italian women work more in the house I must say that it's entirely OUR fault.
With his American wife Jim used to do EVERYTHING! And I really mean everything. She didn't cook so they bought "frozen-ready-to-microwave" stuff. She didn't clean the house and they had a maid. Whatever the maid didn't do Jim did. He cleaned after her and I must say that he is a very orderly and clean person.
On the other hand now I do all the cooking. Whenever he wants to go out for dinner I usually tell him I prefere to eat "my own food". Up to now, I haven't had a job and I have been doing all the house work, cleaning, ironing, etc.....
I do complain sometimes but then when he tries to help I come up with: "leave it, I'll do it, I am much faster than you (that is true) and I end up doing it anyway.
I have set a number of duties that are absolutely "HIS" that is taking out the trash, or car maintenance or fixing stuff in the house, but to honor the truth I should add that he absolutely loves to fix things and I absolutely hate to take the trash out. Other than that I do most of the "house stuff".
I am going to start working soon, I have one week and then I will be out of the house all week, just like him, but other than giving him another duty or two (I am thinking about vacuum the floor and carpet) I don't see many changes and that's not because he is not willing to help but mostly because I want things done "MY way" as I want to eat "my own food", wash the floor with my detergents etc....
I guess it's a cultural thing as I am used to my father doing absolutely nothing in the house and my mother doing everyhing, even if they both worked full time and both did the same job.
So, the same person (Jim) used to do so much with his ex wife and with me he helps but not like he did before. My mom visited for 2 weeks in october and she kept saying she sees Jim becoming just like my father. She also believes it's "OUR" fault.


Dora

Jeffo,

See... Finding an Italian wife isn't such a bad idea after all, is it!

quote:

I guess it's a cultural thing as I am used to my father doing absolutely nothing in the house and my mother doing everyhing, even if they both worked full time and both did the same job.
So, the same person (Jim) used to do so much with his ex wife and with me he helps but not like he did before. My mom visited for 2 weeks in october and she kept saying she sees Jim becoming just like my father. She also believes it's "OUR" fault.

Mom needs to take the credit for modeling this behavior for you when you were a child.

Dora, you need to work WITH Jim, and not be so picky. You are modeling a behavior for a little boy that will not be acceptable or useful in his future.

To me making a home is a cooperative adventure. Maybe it's why I'm not married.

Dora - I've lived with several boyfriends - all of them have done their share of housework (and one was Latin American - my Latin American girlfriends were amazed!) The secret is - don't do everything yourself! And don't make him feel that he has to do things "your" way. So long as the bathroom gets clean - who cares how it's done? So long as dinner is on the table - who cares if the rice is a bit crunchy?

I also come from a family where my dad did nothing around the house and my mum did everything and both had the same job. They are in their 60s/70s - I am in my 30s - times have changed!

Anyway - keeping house is a cooperative exercise - when Jim starts talking about a dish he likes to cook - say "that sounds yum - how about cooking it tomorrow night?" You need to let him know that his way of cooking and cleaning is OK - and stop seeing housework as only your job.

Good luck!

quote:

You need to let him know that his way of cooking and cleaning is OK...

If that doesn't work, get out the rolling pin.

I wonder whether Jim and Dora take turns at the one computer? Or is it dueling computers?

quote:

Originally posted by Bill 2:

quote:

You need to let him know that his way of cooking and cleaning is OK...

If that doesn't work, get out the rolling pin.

If the rolling pin doesn't work, there's always the cast iron skillet.

Ann
My Life in Italy

quote:

Originally posted by Bill 2:

quote:

You need to let him know that his way of cooking and cleaning is OK...

If that doesn't work, get out the rolling pin.

Ever thought of being a marriage guidance counsellor Bill?

quote:

Originally posted by Jim in Baltimore (was Perugia):
Jeffo,

See... Finding an Italian wife isn't such a bad idea after all, is it!

Absolutely, it's not a bad thing. The problem is I've been living alone for a while so I have my own way of doing things too. So if my ways don't go along with her ways...
I guess she could use the cast iron skillet.


Jeffo