Hi, I am an Italian woman living in Italy, married to an American. I was reading the comments of some expats and I honestly could not help but wondering why they came here if they dislike my Country so much and have nothing good to say about it?
I believe it takes a strong and open minded person to live abroad because, yes, it's not an easy thing. I have lived in California for 1 year and, despite someone says it's the best place to live on earth... I decided to come back home! Yeah! Can you believe it?
To that girl who wrote wondering why ITALIANS do not take you seriously if you are someone's girlfriend (not married) I can say I felt the same way when I lived in California. My future parents in law in fact behaved the same way and were kind of hostile. And they are American.
To that guy who said that ITALIANS do not like Americans I can say that, reading these comments, it seems the thing goes both ways!
However, it is not true that ITALIANS do not like Americans. Some might not, many do.
To that guy who blamed ITALIANS to be racist mentioning the party "Lega Nord", I can say "what about your ghettos, your bad j/ks on Polish, Mexicans, Black people, your KU KUX CLAN and so on?" Come on!
The problem with Italians is the opposite!
They welcome anybody... it's easy to come here. Lega Nord just want to regulate things because our (too) OPEN borders appealed alot of BAD people who did not come here to work but to steal, rape, kill. This is just reality.
About that girl who cannot find international foods. It just depends on where you live.
Even in the US, as anywhere, you might not find everything if you live in the middle of nowhere.
Personally, I can find everything here--- even too much if you think to who has nothing.
To that guy who was wondering why ITALIANS enjoy ruining their monuments with graffitis I can tell the first graffitis I saw where in NY and Toronto.
Vandals and idiots are everywhere.
Still, if you can only talk **** about the country who is guesting you, maybe you should just consider to go back home, as I did.
It's a much wiser and mature choice that to keep on criticize someone else's country and life style. Don't you think so too?
(I apologize for my English).

Cristina

Hi Cristina and welcome.

I understand your comments completely but just so you know, this forum was for people to have a place to vent their annoyances with others. It is hard being a foreigner but it does help being able to talk to others about it. There may be a few complaints that we make but I believe most here would not trade Italy for anyplace else. I don't complain that much about Italy anymore but I did when I first came. Oh and I also complained when I lived in the U.S. where I was born and raised.

Please don't take everything as a personal attack on Italy.

This is a good thread. I came here originally because the Air Force sent me here. I fell in love with Italy (Friuli in particular) and decided I wanted to stay.

As for the complaining, I think it's just an outlet for people to vent. Afterwards they feel better having gotten whatever disturbs them off their chest. You're right though- if they feel the bad outweighs the good, they definitely should consider moving on to greener pastures.

Hi Cristina - personally I don't criticise Italy in order to say that MY home country is perfect - far from it. Yes, some things in the UK are better but some are worse. Some things about Italy absolutely infuriate me - and seeing as I live here, work here and pay my taxes I think I have earned the right to comment.

A friend of mine overheard a conversation between three Italians complaining about trenitalia. When he had the nerve to agree with them, they all turned on him as being a "straniero" they didn't think he had the right to complain!

To answer your question, I came here for work and I stayed for my husband. If it weren't for family ties then I wouldn't be living here now that's for sure. That doesn't mean that I think Italy is awful but that there are some aspects of Italy (like any other country) that are - aren't we allowed to mention them? After all not all foreigners live in villas in Chiantishire?!

It is a thread I can't resist. I rarely complain about Italy to anyone other than maybe my wife. After 2 1/2 years of living here full time I'm still a bit of a polyanna (male version), I don't say it's the best place in the World, I don't know where that is, but I'm happy living here.

It's funny when Luisa and I lived in California we had a lot of native Italian friends and most of them complained plenty about the life there. I was tempted a few times to suggest they just go home.

Anyway it's natural to comlain when you live in an environment so different from what you grew up with and it is true I believe that life is hard here for many people who struggle economically. I'll stick my neck out and say it's mostly the women who complain, they often come here for a man, romance in romantic Italy, and then find out that the daily life is not all that romantic. Funny my Italian wife told me again this morning that she would never, I don't totally believe her, have married an Italian.

Anyway Christina68 I too wonder sometimes why some who seem to dislike so much about Italy stay, everyone has their reasons, and I'm sure many stay because they more or less have to, or maybe it's just better to them than the alternatives.

Considering going back home is the easy part... actually moving back is the hard part. I moved here because it was easy for me. I was born here, so citizenship was never a problem. My family roots are here. I fell in love with an Italian man and the rest is history. Every expat is different and has their own story. It may have been easy for you to leave California after one year, maybe because it was just you? No family in tow? I don't know you, so I can only make an assumption. I ask myself quite often why I am still here. Lately I have been having more bad luck than good here. Unfortunately, I can't just up and leave because I have two young children to think about and I really need to think long and hard about how moving back and forth could affect them in the long run.

Hi Cristina. I came to Italy from California because I just wanted to, no man, no specific job, just a desire to be here, and I have spent 20 out of my 51 years living here.
Yes, I complain, just like I did in California about the homeless, busing, pigeons, and plenty of other things I can't remember. I think it is just the nature of people to complain, and they generally make comparisons when they do. Sometimes when you're having a bad day, and you know things would not have been this way at "home" it easy to get ticked off.
Ever try to find a decent espresso in California, believe me I have tried and my family and friends in S.F. have heard me talk about it ad nauseum. By the same token I can't find a decent bagel here (yes I know I could make them but I am basically lazy). My doctor's waiting room in California looked like a hotel lobby, but he did not come to my house ASAP when I or one of my kids was sick. And interestingly enough, I moved from Tuscany to the Marche two years ago and manage to complain about things that happen or things they do in the Marche that don't happen or they don't do in Tuscany (and I'm sure the Marchigiani love me for it).
In the end it is a trade off for all of us, there are good things and bad things everywhere, and no matter where we live we are going to complain about the bad ones. And this, for many of us, is the place to do so.
So, please don't be offended and realize most of us live here because we want to and cannot imagine going "home".

Like Jhelm I am a Pollyanna. I can't imagine living anywhere else. I don't have to work, that makes it easier, but I didn't have to work in California either. I moved here because I loved Italy and still feel the same way.

Brava. Well, I moved here because in California, my Italian wife would cry 2-3x a week missing home, so here we are. We've been here 1.5 years. In the 1st 6 months I complained to my wife (in private, always) about things that drove me crazy about the Italian system - now I think it was a way for me, as a man, to claim control of my surroundings - complain. That has given way to a deep love of Italian culture, and while I notice things that are dysfunctional, because I read the newspaper etc., I also read the news of the US, and am glad to be here.

My wife kicks herself for moving because she left her dream job in the US. Then I look at our two little children enjoying Italian life, the language, nonni, la mare, the food, etc. I have my ups and downs, just like I did and do about the US, but then I go out with a friend and feel 'at home'. At times, I wish I was born here, so I could be Italian - I am always trying to understand who Italians are.

I believe expats may complain and b*tch because they feel Italy could improve - just like their homelands could. I think it shows a love of the country. My Italian father-in-law complains about Italy non-stop, and I mean non-stop, but this is his home and he loves it to death.

From this thread I am guessing that those who are happiest in Italy:
- don't have to work
- live in "nice" areas with relatively little crime, pollution etc

I don't mean this as a criticism - far from it - but I would guess that ANY country is better if you are in that situation. A lot of what I complain about living here is related to the (difficult) work situation here and the problems of living in a city. It is not necessarily a reflection on the whole nation and its inhabitants!

quote:

From this thread I am guessing that those who are happiest in Italy:
- don't have to work
- live in "nice" areas with relatively little crime, pollution etc

Good point. And like you say, with this criteria you could be happy in quite a lot of places.

quote:

- live in "nice" areas with relatively little crime, pollution etc

Well that would be Belluno, but even at my age with two small children I still have to and could actually not imagine not working. But then I like my work.

quote:

Originally posted by Cristina68:
Hi, I am an Italian woman living in Italy, married to an American. I was reading the comments of some expats and I honestly could not help but wondering why they came here if they dislike my Country so much and have nothing good to say about it?
I believe it takes a strong and open minded person to live abroad because, yes, it's not an easy thing. I have lived in California for 1 year and, despite someone says it's the best place to live on earth... I decided to come back home! Yeah! Can you believe it?
To that girl who wrote wondering why ITALIANS do not take you seriously if you are someone's girlfriend (not married) I can say I felt the same way when I lived in California. My future parents in law in fact behaved the same way and were kind of hostile. And they are American.
To that guy who said that ITALIANS do not like Americans I can say that, reading these comments, it seems the thing goes both ways!
However, it is not true that ITALIANS do not like Americans. Some might not, many do.
To that guy who blamed ITALIANS to be racist mentioning the party "Lega Nord", I can say "what about your ghettos, your bad j/ks on Polish, Mexicans, Black people, your KU KUX CLAN and so on?" Come on!
The problem with Italians is the opposite!
They welcome anybody... it's easy to come here. Lega Nord just want to regulate things because our (too) OPEN borders appealed alot of BAD people who did not come here to work but to steal, rape, kill. This is just reality.
About that girl who cannot find international foods. It just depends on where you live.
Even in the US, as anywhere, you might not find everything if you live in the middle of nowhere.
Personally, I can find everything here--- even too much if you think to who has nothing.
To that guy who was wondering why ITALIANS enjoy ruining their monuments with graffitis I can tell the first graffitis I saw where in NY and Toronto.
Vandals and idiots are everywhere.
Still, if you can only talk **** about the country who is guesting you, maybe you should just consider to go back home, as I did.
It's a much wiser and mature choice that to keep on criticize someone else's country and life style. Don't you think so too?
(I apologize for my English).



Cristina

Ciao Cristina,

everthing, oh, so true.
But we're here just to fight tunnel views, right? And believe me, there is venting and venting. I mean, they have the right of venting, they work and pay taxes and live here. Here it's their home. And anyway, sometimes they're right, and it's refreshing for an Italian born and raised to hear another bell on the (real) troubles plaguing this wonderful Country of ours.
And please, pay attention to posts...most times the people venting in a narrow minded way are not American....

Un saluto comprensivo,
Chia

quote:

most times the people venting in a narrow minded way are not American....

*Most times* - not sure about that, but it's true, I am a non-American venter

I sometimes wonder if there is a board like this one for Italians in England. That would be interesting to read. I imagine there is a similar US board, but not sure if there is a UK based one.

I wanted to thank everybody for writing me back.
I know it's easy to complain (I did it about some American's ways too) and people have the right to do it. For sure Italy has alot of things to improve as many other countries do. It's also true that life depends on where you live and how but I also think that life it's what you make of it. You have always to make an effort to look at things from their best side, otherwise you risk not to be happy anywhere in the world. I learned that living in the US and travelling abroad and I believe I have a more positive attitude now about "differences". I wish you all a nice stay! If you like you can write me at: cri-gil@tele2.it Cristina

I would like to comment on this thread since I believe I am "that" girl who said Italians do not take you seriously when you are just a girlfriend (not married). It's amazing when sentences are taken from a discussion which totally takes it out of the context it was originally meant. I was replying to a thread from someone who was missing home, wasn't totally accepted by her future in laws yet and wondered whether it would get any better. I replied I felt the same and that my OH's family didn't "take me into their hearts" straight away and I believed it was because I was one of many girlfriends he had had and they didn't know if I would last. I totally understand their position, why get to know someone and get attached to them if they are just one of many that will come and go. That wasn't a criticism of them, that was my boyfriends fault for being a ****!

In that particular discussion I also mentioned that that was how things were in the beginning and things do change over the years. I have been totally accepted by OH's family now since we have been together 10 years and we are still not married. I love Italian, Italians and think myself lucky to live (part time) in this beautiful country. Of course it has its faults like anywhere and I will have the odd moan but that's rare. My OH is Italian and complains more about his country (politics, garbage, camorra, corruption) but he is Italian and he has the right!

If you pull sentences out of an old discussion of course it makes it look like people are complaining but what you have done is remove the bigger picture. People will have a moan from time to time, we all do it but the positive threads about Italy outweigh the negative ones on this site. Just because someone has had a bad experience and wants to vent on this site doesn't mean they should pack up and go. You get good days and bad days everywhere.

I would agree if all you do is moan and do not like living in a particular country, then move on if you can. With the majority on this site though, we have a moan about "why do they do this??" etc but then you may wake up the next morning with sun rising, church bells ringing and the smell of fresh coffee wafting through the air and think "I love this place!". Oh my, I miss it so much!

I think the comment about non-Americans being the venters is interesting! Wasn't the most recent biggest venter an American? Ok, so he did go home but he still popped up a few times until Cristina gave him the heave-ho! Also aren't we non-Americans in the minority here? Maybe our remarks - when we vent - just stand out. Interesting..

I came here to find a really hot, I mean beautiful, southern Italian girl and marry her and then we would go back to the US where all my friends would be really jealous. I'm still here so maybe I'm losing and venting because of that.
I guess this plan works better when you're the President of France!!!!


Jeffo

Oh, I just though of something, "why did you come here?" is the question I get asked so often by Italians when I say I am from the US. Serious!!

Yep, I get this from Italian friends too when they know we lived in the UK!

The answer is - the grass is always greener on the other side. You could live in the most beautiful place in the world and still yearn for something different. When you are used to living amongst certain things you get complacent and don't appreciate them as much as a newcomer does. We have people from all over the world come into the restaurant and they say "we just love Scotland, beautiful scenery, lochs, friendly people etc" whereas we are here all the time and see the drunks, crime, graffiti and the terrible weather. A foreigner tends to see things with different eyes no matter what country we are talking about.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeffo:
I came here to find a really hot, I mean beautiful, southern Italian girl and marry her and then we would go back to the US where all my friends would be really jealous. I guess this plan works better when you're the President of France!!!!

Jeffo

Worked for me and I'm not even the President of France. Keep looking!!!

edited to fix quote

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