I too am pregnant (25 weeks) and as I said in an earlier post, I was also told at my last appointment that I should "stai attenta" (be careful) what I eat. What made me laugh was that 6 weeks before I was told to eat a bit more as I had not gained anything in the first 4 months.

My friends and family in the UK think this is all crazy as doctors and midwives are much more relaxed there about weight gain in pregnancy.

I've decided to just carry on as I have been doing and follow a healthy diet and if I feel like an extra piece of bread, a huge helping of lasagne or a chocolate croissant then I will. After all, if you can't indulge a bit when you are pregnant, then when can you?

I know from my first pregnancy that whatever weight I'll put on will (probably)come off during the first few months anyway (especially if you breast feed) so what's the problem? As long as mother and baby are both happy and healthy - that's all that matters!

Take care, relax and enjoy....

Wise words Janey.
I'm sure if/when it happens to me I'll be using the phrase "I'm eating for two" all the time.

< Delina

I have just found this thread, I didn't even know my story had been put on the site! I just want to add that I have read through this thread and to my surprise found Pamela6000's story. Pam and I had the same Doctor, the one who made us both have cesareans.
I know this is all supposed to be about hospitals and pregnancy, but I just would like to tell you what has been happening in the last few days here..even if pregnancy hasd nothing to do with it.

My partner Carlo was hit by a car on his way home from work on Saturday evening. His motorbike landed on top of him. An ambulance was called and he was taken to Castiglione (Emergency unit) near Amalfi. I wasn't allowed to go in the ambulance with him, so I had to call a friend to take me, as I had given up driving a couple of years ago.
When we arrived at the hospital Carlo was sitting alone in a room in a wheelchair. The Doctors came in and said that there were no beds free so he couldn't stay. ( They had x rayed him and found a fractured ankle, and broken leg).
He was shipped off to the only hospital in the region with a free bed, Nocera, about an hor 20 minutes drive from Positano.
Four days later, his bandages hadn't been changed, (he had scraped all the skin off his elbows when he landed on the road), he hadn't been given any anti inflammatory medicine, no ice packs, and had not been able to wash since he was brought in. I had to change the bandages myself, bring in a bowl and flannel from home to wash him with. We asked if there was a shower and were told that there wasn't... no shpwer in a huge busy hospital. I had to bring him toilet paper too, as that is not provided. THe call buttons to call the nurses don't work and I had to ask 3 times for them to bring some disinfectant to clean his wounds. We have figured out now, that it all depends on who you know, so we have had to ask the 'important' people in town to make phonecalls to the 'important' people in the hospital so that they actually start doing something.
Today (thursday) they said that maybe on Saturday they will put on a plastercast with screws attatched, if by tuesday the screws have not pushed the bone into place, they will have to operate.
I, meanwhile am trying to work 6 hours in a shop, find people who will take care of our daughter, as my babysitter conveniantly quit on Sunday, drive to the hospital to wash, clean etc Carlo, while also trying to get all the paperwork for the accident organized...Comune, Carabinieri, Vigile, the first hospital...
Carlos family have not offered to help, but luckily I have friends like Pamela6000 who today looked after my daughter for the whole day.
Ok, rant over, sorry, back to the birth stories!

Gia- Gina,

I am a chef who specializes in food that heals, and I agree with everyone about the need for calcium, and that it should not come from a pill.

However, I do not agree that it has to come from dairy. The problem with milk and non cultured dairy is that it is 50% carbohydrate, and since you are having some GD issues, it is best to keep the carbs low and those that you enjoy should be enjoyed with alot of fiber to slow down their absorption and decrease the stress on your pancreas.

Instead enjoy parsely--loads, sesame seeds or tahini, kale, dark leafy greens (not spinach or swiss chard as they have oxcalic acid which inhibits calcium absorption) avoid tomato, peppes and eggplant and coffee as they also tax your calcium reserves, (this is only for a short time, you can do it if you want to go this way). figs have tons of fiber and tons of calcium (but a lot of sugar, so ingest them judiciously) pomegranates also have tons of calcium.

Yogurt has more easily digested calcium.

WHile other dairy foods have a lot of calcium on the nutritional charts, what the charts don't say is that the ratio of protein to calcium and fat (esp in low fat dairy) diminishes the absorbability of calcium.

The wonderful thing about the dark leafy greens is so many other wonderful things that they bring to your body at this important time.

http://www.susunweed.com/Article_Pregnancy_Problems.htm

check out this site for herbs that will help provide you with the minerals that your body needs without all the issues of dairy or weight gain.

Just my two cents, good luck.

A new study on elective C-sections:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14838765/

Siciliana,
I love your advice and agree with it too but I wanted to let you know how restrictive the dietician was being:

No seeds, so no sesame seeds
No oils at all so no sesame oil
No yogurt at all

I am limited but found soy milk with added calcium and she says that is okay. I know adult Italians do not drink a ton of milk but I like a tall glass a day even when not pregnant so I am drinking soy and rice milk to make up for the dairy.

I have found brocolli, cauliflower and lots of salad greens but as you know stuff is seasonal here and so I am out of luck until some veggie come into season again but I love kale and dark leavy greens and will look for them at the market.

P.S. Went to the gyno last night and he agrees that losing 5 kilos now will be hard. So he recommends I try to maintain my weight and not gain more. BTW, I have lost .5 kilos in two weeks of my low sugar, low carb diet.

Niki, I have copied your post into an email and sent it to a friend who is a doctor in the system and an activist for patient rights. I have asked her to look into what can be done because this is shameful.
Having had an accident with similar injuries, I know how important it is to get the right care from the right medics. I think if something like that happened here, there would be doctors on rails with tar and feathers. It's attitudes like you are running into that end up front page telegiornale scandals. They always seem to be in the south or Sicily, don't they?
When I hear from her I'll contact you on your blog page, or if you like, contact me from here with a better way. Sorry I can't babysit, because babies are wonderful and I would if you were closer.

quote:

Originally posted by siciliana in training:
Instead enjoy parsely--loads

Parsley is not a particularly good idea. It may be rich in calcium, but it also promotes abortions (besides being a mild poison: one would have to eat quite a load of it, but it's a close relative to hemlock). Parsley is one of the herbs that were traditionally used by "mammane" to cause abortion in women who wanted to get rid of unwanted pregnacies before interruzione volontaria di gravidanza (IVG) became legal in Italy and quite a few women died of the pratice every year.

It sounds like something pregnant women should avoid then.

Anyway, pregnant or not, it doesn't sound very appealling to me eating loads of parsley! Just a few leaves is sufficient for me.

quote:

Originally posted by Judith in Umbria:
Niki, I have copied your post into an email and sent it to a friend who is a doctor in the system and an activist for patient rights. I have asked her to look into what can be done because this is shameful.
Having had an accident with similar injuries, I know how important it is to get the right care from the right medics. I think if something like that happened here, there would be doctors on rails with tar and feathers. It's attitudes like you are running into that end up front page telegiornale scandals. They always seem to be in the south or Sicily, don't they?
When I hear from her I'll contact you on your blog page, or if you like, contact me from here with a better way. Sorry I can't babysit, because babies are wonderful and I would if you were closer.

So glad that you are doing this Judith! What Niki describes is incredibly dangerous. What if her partner did not have such a committed family member to do basic nursing care?

As they say, the biggest advance in modern medicine was made when doctors started washing their hands. Not cleaning a patients wounds or providing basic sanitation is incredibly dangerous.

I heard about parsley being a bit "iffy" in pregnancy too. My friend told me about it after she saw me eating a lot of tabouli this summer.

Everything so far I have read about Italian hospitals, whether for pregnancy or otherwise, makes me fear getting ill or having an accident whilst in Italy, particularly because I am in the South. If it happened to either DH or myself I think I’d prefer to drag myself back to the UK unless we were incapacitated.

Nicki, I remember years ago I broke my ankle (the bones both sides) playing hockey. I didn’t realise I’d broken it and it wasn’t until I hopped to hospital the next day that I knew. As soon as they’d ex-rayed me I was taken into the ward and had an operation (under GE) the very same day to put metal plates in my ankle. What a difference to the treatment you describe.

What exactly do Italian nurses do if they don’t clean and look after patients – do they take long coffee breaks or something?

thank you Judith, thats very kind of you! As of this morning the Doctors have changed their mind and decided that they will have to operate....but not until Tuesday.
And I have just been told that the main road from Sorrento to the Motorway has been closed. So I might not be able to go today.

I can't believe how different medical care is in the south compared to the north. In Milan, the situation is by no means perfect but I'm sure that some of these experiences would be unheard of.

The same goes for epidurals which were discussed last week. As far as I'm aware, they are readily available in all hospitals in Milan but I read here that it is very difficult to get them in the south.

By the way, I read in "Donna Moderna" that the Italian Minister for Health is trying to ensure epidurals are available in all Italian hospitals....but don't ask me from when!

I think you would have to eat literally a TON of parsley to induce any abortion in early pregnancy. Gia Gina--don't worry about eating tabouleh. There are very few herbs that produce strong and violent reactions. The ones that do are not generally mass marketed. You should be more worried about eating meat, IMO. SO contaminated. (Even if Italy doesn't inject with hormones, animals are treated porrly around the globe to accomodate populations, etc.)

Gia-gina--I am concerned that you are so "restricted." No dairy? WTF? Please eat healthy, eat a well-rounded diet and F&%@ these doctors trying to scare you.

So what about home births? I had 3 babies in UK,
All at home all in birthing pools.so if I am crazy enough to do it again (new man so may have to consider it!)what will happen??
I was told my first labour would be at least 24 hrs,1 hr an 20 mins after first contrction I was cuddling him, second I had 1 contraction and hubby delivered him 2o mins later (5 mins before midwife arrived)and 3rd time 55 mins from start to finish.Fact is even if I wanted to go to hospital I may not get there and they certainly wont have time to sharpen their knives!so I am going to the docs this afternoon (the one who hates prescribing me the pill as hes religious)and I am going to see what he thinks, should be fun

quote:

Originally posted by Jill:
I am going to the docs this afternoon (the one who hates prescribing me the pill as hes religious)and I am going to see what he thinks, should be fun

Why don't you change doctors???

Because I like making him feel uncomfortable, the first time I went to ask for the pill I was asked if I had a husband (he went back to uk to his bit on the side so after 6 months alone I got a new man)
Anyway I was tempted to tell the truth and say yes I have a husband and a lover! but thought I might be put in the naughty corner and not get my pills!
Anyway if I tell him I am considering another baby I might gain points, you never know!

quote:

I was told my first labour would be at least 24 hrs,1 hr an 20 mins after first contrction I was cuddling him, second I had 1 contraction and hubby delivered him 2o mins later (5 mins before midwife arrived)and 3rd time 55 mins from start to finish.Fact is even if I wanted to go to hospital I may not get there and they certainly wont have time to sharpen their knives!

Wow! Lucky lady

Now that is thread is back in the side bar I wanted to make a comment. I had the baby and am doing really well. She was 4 weeks early but had no problems whatsoever. I posted her birth story in the kids in Italy section of the forum for those who are interested.

The support that I got on this board and this thread was/is amazing and helped me through some tough times. I can't say enough about how great everyone was being. I want to extend the same help if I can, so if anyone wants to talk about the birthing process etc... email me: giaparsons@hotmail.com I will more than happy to chat, email or whatever. Thank you everyone.

Ok, this may sound like a weird request, but can you please put the sprogbaby blog in your signature? Veronica is a little darling!

quote:

Originally posted by Kimberly:
I think this a great topic and I have enjoyed reading the comments and personal experiences but - gosh! - I think I would have been pretty scared to have a baby in Italy had I read this first! My two little boys were born in Rome and it was such a fantastic experience, even better than I think I would have had in the States. My friends back home had a max of 2 ultrasounds per pregnancy. I had one each month during my doctors' visits. It certainly wasn't necessary but it reassured me. My second baby had jaundice and they kept me in the clinic for a week with the baby while he was under the bili lights (in the US, friends in similar situations have been kicked out of the hospital because of higher costs, forced to go home while leaving their newborn). Although I was supposed to express milk the nurses would feed him, I built a good relation with the nurses who would let me come down and nurse him and cuddle him. I roomed in, had a quiet, private room and had a mid-wife who made home visits and helped me start off on the right foot with nursing. I am stepping on a landmine here, but I do not disagree with an emphasis on lower weight gain. Many of my girlfriends in America put on a lot of weight during pregnancy, leading to more difficult labors and post-partum depression when all those pounds didn't come off easily. I agree not to be obsessed about it but I do think it is a doctor's job to point out the risks and ensure you are as healthy as possible throughout your pregnancy. I had two completely natural births with a doctor who I knew had a very low rate of C-sections, so I felt confident he wouldn't "invent" an emergency that I would certainly not have the medical knowledge to dispute in the delivery room. I think that you can have awonderful birth experience in Italy and I highly recommend it to everyone, BUT you have to really do your homework (as many readres have pointed out) and ensure that you and your doctor have the same philosophy. Good luck to all the future moms out there!

Where did you give birth?????

quote:

Originally posted by Janey:
Hi there

I'm new to this site but saw that someone was trying to decide where to give birth in Milan and so I thought I'd write in too.

I've been living in Milan for 7 years now and gave birth to my son in January 2004 at Mangiagalli.I am now pregnant with my second child and am planning to attend the antenatal course and give birth at Macedonio Melloni.

From my experience, Mangiagalli is excellent in providing all the prenatal check-ups etc but struggles to cope with the masses of women who go there to give birth. My first birth was fine but I had the assistance of my gynaecologist and the head obstetrician which I know. This time however, neither of them will be available (I'm due on 1 Jan 2007) so have decided to go somewhere else.

I wasn't very happy with the nursery at all. Apart from morning rounds, nobody seemed to check on how my baby was doing, feeding, changing etc.. I kept him with me the whole time even if it meant very little sleep for 3 days!

I have received many reports, including from my friend from my first antenatal course that it is more and more common for women to be left on trolleys in the corridor for up to 2 days due to beds not being available. In fact, my friend said that after having her 2nd child in February she was in a corridor with two ladies which had been there since the day before. Her husband went to Santa Caterina (the private clinic) to enquire about a private room) but they were all full as well.

Personally, I don't want to run the risk of that happening to me, I mean the whole experience is difficult enough as it is!

I have chosen Macedonio Melloni as two of my friends have both had 2 children there and speak very highly of both the care received by the mother during the birth and by the baby during its first few days there.

I hope this helps somehow!

Jane

Hello, How was your experience? Would you recommend the hospital?